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Post by darkglobe on Nov 13, 2006 9:25:31 GMT -5
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dante
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Post by dante on Nov 14, 2006 11:00:15 GMT -5
WOW!! Whereas i am thrilled for CB i can't help but feel that if any film doesn't need to be remade it is this one. I shudder at the thought of computer generated chains and hooks pulling apart computer generated victims etc etc Obviously though i'll still be first in the queue at the cinema hehehehe ;D
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Aaron
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Post by Aaron on Nov 14, 2006 14:10:39 GMT -5
I have to voice my doubts here. I agree with Dante, this "remake bug" that is going around is troublesome. I very rarely have seen remakes that were as good as their originals. Hellraiser was astonishing for its time. I worry in this age of censorship and political correctness something will be lost. You CANNOT make films now like you could then.
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dante
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Post by dante on Nov 15, 2006 6:24:19 GMT -5
Yeah, the only remake i can think of that i prefer to the original is Cronenberg's The Fly.... They'll probably remake that remake next
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Post by Baphomette on Nov 15, 2006 8:26:41 GMT -5
My first thought was 'interesting'. My second was 'why?'. Frankly, I don't think that Hellraiser needs to be remade, but I suppose they have to do something to generate interest and/or profit for the 20th anniversary. Seems a shame really, especially since it would have to be recast, which, in my less than humble opinion, would be nothing short of sacrilege. Still, it does seem that the remake as an institution has become a substitute for genuine creativity in this day and age. Plus, the bandwagon seems to be a very alluring mode of transportation, so Clive Barker might as well hop on, too. I'd prefer that he directed his energies toward a special edition of Nightbreed instead, but that probably goes without saying.
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dante
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Post by dante on Nov 16, 2006 4:00:31 GMT -5
Completely agree. In fact, after The Fly, the only other remakes i can think of that i really liked were Carpenter's The Thing, and the '88 remake of The Blob. All 3 films were remade MANY years after their respective originals, and were all substantially different in content too. My point, as i labour to get to it, is that it is just too soon to be remaking Hellraiser. It is still so fresh in everyone's mind that i can't see how they would be able to add anything new to it. In my opinion there shouldn't even be anything added to it. The film is nigh-on perfect as is. I hate that standard excuse the execs churn out - 'to bring his fantastic vision to the big screen for a new generation of fans'...... What a load of cobblers!! (er, sorry that's rhyming slang for cobbler's alls.... .....Balls) What they really mean is - 'to try and fleece some more cash from the movie going public'..... I hear that Del Toro is remaking Creature From The Black Lagoon - well, i can just about stomach that, even though i regard the original as a classic. I feel that they could add a few new things to that story, and it would be cool to see what new technologies could bring to it - as long as i doesn't turn out too much like Anaconda i guess. But no no no no NO - i just can't accept that someone somewhere, even Clive himself, thinks that remaking Hellraiser is a worthwhile venture, or even a good idea. This is really eating my gilbert grape.....
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Post by Baphomette on Nov 17, 2006 8:44:37 GMT -5
Y'know, Clive Barker may not even be all that involved with the project. Sure, he's been given writing and producing credits, but the worrying thing is that if they don't make drastic changes to the script, he's already written it & producing could be tantamount to providing a few props and/or certain designs from the original film. Granted, it's all just speculation at this point, but it obviously won't be 'Clive Barker's Hellraiser' if he isn't directing it. It'll simply be Clive Barker's vision as seen through someone else's eyes. Unless they pull a 'Psycho' with it, in which case it'll be Clive Barker's vision of 'Hellraiser' rehashed by some hack who lacks the ability to have their own vision with actors striving to be same rather than playing characters. Think Anne Heche as Janet Leigh as Marion Crane. Oh, the humanity. I try to avoid most remakes because they annoy me, but I've seen enough of them to know that nine times out of ten they're very disappointing. Regardless, I doubt it'll be the worst remake ever. I'm fairly sure that particular title belongs to either the 1997 mini-series version of 'The Shining' or Tom Savini's thoroughly craptastic remake of 'Night Of The Living Dead'.
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Post by darkglobe on Nov 18, 2006 10:04:28 GMT -5
Del Toro isn't doing the Creature remake anymore. If my cobwebed mind remembers correctly, Universal was in the early 90's going for a John Carpenter-directed Black Lagoon (which was to involve an underwater Creature pyramid temple and multiple creatures), and Clive Barker was going to reimagine The Mummy. Eventually, the Mummy did get remade by Stephen Summers, but the Creature remake remained undone. Del Toro then came up with a great idea for a remake (basically, the Creature as an underwater sex god/Tarzan that would have been more like a doomed romantic fantasy), but for whatever reason this too was unmade. Now it's November 2006, and there actually is a remake being made. But it doesn't look good: it's being directed by Breck Eisner, son of Michael "King of Disney" Eisner, who directed that recent adventure film Saharha. It's being written by the guy who wrote Tom Hanks' Big and Pleasantville. But I'll see it if it looks like it's fun, though I'm not going to hold my breath for a masterpiece. As for why remake Hellraiser, I think it has to do with trying to get bigger and bigger budgets while the studio money men try to figure out ways to increase revenue by creating something that is "known", so that theoretically there is less risk. I think that if studios went for more creativity and smaller budgets, and were happy with less than 60 million dollar opening weekends, things would be better. I've heard that Clive plans to do a final Pinhead story where he meets Harry D'Amour, so maybe this deal with give him some money to do other things, as well as leave him with the feeling that he's had his say with the Pinhead concept. Here's an interesting thought about remakes in general, though - who is your favorite Dracula? There has been so many Dracula's over the years, and so many good ones that I would have trouble saying which Dracula film did it so well that no other Dracula film should ever be made again. Nosferatur is a masterpiece, but Bela's Dracula seems to have defined the role up through when Christopher Lee took over. Then there is the great versions where the immortal count is played by Louis Jordan & Jack Palance in the 70's. So you'd think Drac was done, but then Gary Oldman's Dracula really redefined the old bloodsucker and I would wager he's the bloodsucker that most modern Dracula fans think of as theirs. So I don't think that remakes and reimaginings are always an evil, but that the modern studio system that puts extreme profit by dumbing down stories and concepts into mass pablum so as to not turn away any possible audience is the problem. All the Dracula's I listed above were done more by the artists creating those films, as opposed to studios just churning any of them out.
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Post by Baphomette on Nov 19, 2006 8:50:46 GMT -5
I'm not entirely sure that we can factor Dracula into a remake equation. Vampires were the stuff that folklore, legend and myth were made of long before anyone put pen to paper and wrote about them, much less wrote a book, a screenplay and/or transferred those tales to celluloid. Bram Stoker's 'Dracula' as it/he pertains to the film industry was a reimagining from the moment that Murnau 'borrowed' Stoker's story and decided to call him Nosferatu. Had Bram Stoker been involved with the cinematic production of his story, which he obviously wasn't because ..well.. mortals have a nasty habit of dying, it would be a fabulous example though.
Much of Barker's work is obviously inspired by a strange brew of myth, legend and folklore, but his stories are uniquely his. Had he not been initially involved in the production of 'Hellraiser' for the screen and Pinhead had managed to become the sort of iconic character that Dracula is, he might've warranted more than a handful of reimaginings. However, Clive Barker shared his vision of his tale with the world, and in my opinion, left nothing to be desired that a remake might serve to provide (given the various limitations inherent to adapting a story for the screen).
That's just my two cents though, and I would love to be proven wrong. Sadly, as you've mentioned, Hollywood has a way of chucking greatness into their metaphoric meat grinder & churning out something a mass market would find more palatable.
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Post by darkglobe on Nov 20, 2006 23:31:34 GMT -5
Interesting thing about Nosferatu... it was made without permission of the Bram Stoker estate (which is why he's Count Orloff rather than Count Dracula), and Bram's widow (who was mightily upset with the film version of the book) successfully sued the producers of Nosferatu and won. Part of the conditions of the suit was that all copies of Nosferatu be destroyed... fortunately some film fans decided to keep illicit copies, which is why the masterpiece still exists.
Now, that certainly is a different situation in one sense, in that it was the first cinematic Dracula, but on the other hand it was an unwanted adaption. And I'd say most of the Dracula films have followed some or all of the same elements specific to Stoker's novel: Nosferatu (both versions), Lugosi, Langella, Jordan, some of the Christopher Lee's, and even the Gary Oldman version follow the same basic structure. So I'd say that the ideas behind Dracula are ultimately remakes, and fairly varied ones at that.
So to me, remakes aren't always a bad thing... but they need to get the bean counters out of the creative team's faces, and let people make the movies they want, either original or remake.
Another weird aside - Bram Stoker's widow? Guess who was Stoker's main competion for her hand, the one who almost married her? That's right, it's ol' Dorian Grey himself, Oscar Wilde. And both Bram and Oscar died of complications from syphillis, which is weird considering that one wrote about vampires, and the other wrote about a painting that aged while the real person stayed untouched by sins....
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dante
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Post by dante on Nov 21, 2006 7:44:01 GMT -5
Hmmmmm, after careful thought and much consideration i proclaim Leslie Nielsen's Dracula as the greatest ever..... ;D ok ok obviously i'm only choking your chicken here. I always liked Frank Langella in the 1979 movie, and Christopher Lee in both the 1958 and the 1972 versions - then again Lugosi in the 1931 film is hard to beat too. Interestingly, Baphomette mentioned the 1997 version of The Shining as possibly the worst remake ever - but sticking with the vampire theme here (and Stephen King) i have to say i found the 2004 remake of Salem's Lot just as painful. I agree though, i think Dracula counts more as retelling of a myth than a remake of a film.... I also heard that there's ANOTHER remake of Night Of The Living Dead now, this time in 3D..... released this year and actually starring Sid Haig. i shall reserve judgement on this till i've seen it, but have to ask why why WHY?
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Post by darkglobe on Nov 21, 2006 21:10:20 GMT -5
Historic vampire tales don't have the specifics of the Dracula story... Bram Stoker's Dracula introduces the idea of the Count contracting with somebody (usually Jonathan Harker) to purchase land outside of his homeland, having the land purchaser be tempted and sometimes vamped after the deed is signed, the trip by boat to the New Land (usually England, but sometimes America), the complete killing of the best friend of the land purchaser's wife (who is also nearly killed), and the fearless vampire hunter who knows how to stop the vampire and helps interested parties attempt to find the hidden coffins of native soil until the Count is staked. Most of the Dracula films use some if not all of these story elements, so to my mind they are remakes, because these elements come from Bram's book. As for traditional vampire tales, they don't neccesarily sound like Dracula or act like Dracula is portrayed in the book. A good example is Mercy Brown, the Last American Vampire as staked in 1892; check out this site: www.quahog.org/attractions/index.php?id=50
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Post by Baphomette on Nov 23, 2006 8:37:04 GMT -5
Semantics aside, I'm going to go with George Hamilton as the best Dracula ever. Sun worshipping, evenly tanned, perfectly coiffed vampires really melt my butter. I still maintain that Dracula is a retelling because trying to wrap my mind around the concept of remaking a book makes my brain hurt, but the fact remains that Pinhead is no Dracula. Bummer that. I hadn't heard anything about another remake of 'Night Of The Living Dead', but I need to go vomit now.
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Post by darkglobe on Nov 23, 2006 8:48:27 GMT -5
At least the new NoTLD in 3D has Sid Haig in it!. www.nightofthelivingdead3d.com/I wish there were more voodou zombie films though, like Sugar Hill or Serpent and the Rainbow.
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Post by MrSawyer on Dec 6, 2006 10:32:02 GMT -5
I really don't think Hellraiser needs to be remade, they should go back and remake parts 7 and 8 though. Those movies are just really bad and barely even have Pinhead in them. As long as it's a good remake I won't complain, but I don't see how you could make it better. The movie is fine the way it is in my opinion.
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Post by darkglobe on Jun 16, 2007 20:48:49 GMT -5
Has anything else been heard about this project? In related news, I see that Ashley Lawrence is appearing at a horror con fairly soon....
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Post by DevilInYourBelfry on Jun 18, 2007 16:20:16 GMT -5
I usually go here for my Clive Barker news: www.clivebarker.info/newfilmsd.htmlBut if you're looking for news specificly on Hellraiser this is the place: www.cenobite.com/actually I think that one might be on the Link page of this website already. but I hope that helps
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dante
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Post by dante on Jan 30, 2008 10:19:46 GMT -5
damn...... that link is 'access denied' at work...... Access Denied (content_filter_denied) Your request was denied because of its content categorization: "Entertainment;Violence;Gruesome Content" ENTERTAINMENT!! ??!!?? What a jip!! Any more news on the hellraiser remake? Anyone? I got a copy of a Halloween documentary the other day, which was a behind the scenes look at the Myers series - from the Carpenter classic right through to Resurrection. Quite interesting. Anyways, I can't remember if I heard it in that or whether this was the result of some drunken internet surfing in general, but apparently there is/was an idea floating around of a crossover between Halloween and Hellraiser - kind of a Freddy Vs Jason type thing. It is/was to be called Helloween - in no way related to the identically named german sausage mining cock rock band of the 80's and 90's, although I did like the songs Future World and Dr Stein when I was younger... Anyone else heard of this? The movie....... not the dodgy big hair band...
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Vorscythe
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Post by Vorscythe on Feb 7, 2008 18:29:56 GMT -5
I've given up all hope in the film industry. As an aspiring filmmaker myself, I find myself reconsidering my career choice everyday. I look at the kind of things that entertain today's movie goers and they're everything I hate about movies. Once in a while there's an original film, but never anything ground-breaking. Remaking something like Hellraiser, which was considered pretty damn ground-breaking for its time, would be a poor investment at best for Clive.
PS: Hi, I'm new here. LOVE ME!
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Post by zakary on Dec 24, 2008 23:34:40 GMT -5
Hmmmmm, actually I think the first film could do with a remake. I do feel that there are scenes that could never be effectively reproduced with the same feel but overall there could be a more graphically exciting version with current available effects. I would like to see a more elaborate world depicted inside the cube. What would be really excellent is a Hellraiser Nightbreed Jihad movie based on the comics...... Hmm now that would be kick ass!
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dante
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Post by dante on Mar 12, 2009 15:46:00 GMT -5
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Post by darkglobe on Apr 16, 2009 10:20:21 GMT -5
The new Hellraiser Blue-Ray has a review HERE!
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